Viper-7damn canuckistan news and their fail english
Viper-7from that quote i thought one of "Irked Bergman"'s neighbours was killed last week
electrostaticCan you hear me?
ned0i hear electrostatic
electrostaticYay, haven't been on for a while, had to configure sasl
ned0anyone here an arduino/hobby kit PRO ?!
ned0ACTION emphasizes "PRO"
ned0ACTION mumbles "pros only"
gurkiACTION emphasizes that its bullshit to ask metaquestions.
electrostaticSo, anyway, I am looking for a p-fet that I can not search for in parametrics because of a lack of "leakage" parameter.
ned0ACTION heads to ##casualelectronics
Jan-this movie is crap
Jan-it's one of those ludicrous "steal the launch codes" movies
ned0gurki have you ever seen this kind of setup ?
electrostaticI am looking for low on resistance and low leakage, but the gate charge and switching time can be as high as they want
electrostaticOn a pfet
intranickACTION gives Jan- coffee
Jan-why do they spend so many monies making such crap movies
gurkiid call it "lets buy random stuff from china and put it on a table" setup :P
SpeedEvilelectrostatic: what sort of leakage do you care about
SpeedEvilelectrostatic: also, have you considered a relay
ned0it kind of looks like there are wires running inside the box and some of the pieces are screwed to the box
Jan-intranick ooh thankies
ned0i didn't know if that was a common type of workbox/platform or just a personal preference thing
gurkiim pretty sure thats personal preference
electrostaticI looked at relays, but they tend to require voltage. It's a 3v battery, on a heart rate monitor. I want a clasp to ground the pfet gate
gurkiactually its just stuff on a table
gurkiwith like 5 connectors made into it
intranickJan-: whats up?
electrostaticIt's draining the battery when not in use and I want it to stop
electrostaticI could add a hard switch
ned0gurki there's grid paper too
LuminaxWkmorning folks
electrostaticBut I wanted to be cool and just have it work when you put the buckle on lol
gurkiso obv this guy likes grid paper
gurkinow what? :P
LuminaxWkMey ?
ned0ACTION loves grid paper
electrostaticAnyway, this is the best I have found.
Jan-intranick: we're watching a crappy movie.
Jan-it's crappy.
electrostaticBut it's still low charge high speed so I think there might be better
intranickJan-: you drinking a crappy beer with the crappy movie?
Jan-actually no, I have good beer.
electrostaticThat said, I'll probably become lazy and just add a switch lol
LuminaxWkkill switch?
electrostaticBattery switch
MjrTomdouble tap
LuminaxWkright, same thing
LuminaxWkthat's a small MOSFET...
electrostaticYes. Like I said, this is the best I have found.
electrostaticBut it's still low gate charge, so I'm sure Rds(on) and leakage could be improved
electrostaticBut I don't think anyone actually makes gets optimized for low speed switches
electrostaticI am pretty sure I need high side because it must be directly grounded to your body
SpeedEvilwhy do you want low leakage.
SpeedEvilThat is 100_n_A of leakage
electrostaticYes, and it took me forever to find that. Most are well into the uA
MeXIst3nZI find it frustrating beyond words that there are so many incredibly stupid and annoying people, and then a few that are incredibly skilled and annoyingly gifted. I'm in neither group.
SpeedEvilEven 10uA is well over a year battery life on AAs
electrostaticIthat one is def good enough, at this point I just want to find out if there are lower speed lower leakage ones out ther
SpeedEvilAlso, removing power may kill memory and stuff
electrostaticNah, I have to remove the battery after use now as it is
LuminaxWkspeaking of battery... I might need to get Eneloop for my logitech rumblepad
electrostaticIt's only $100 or so to get a better model, but I'm broke for a while
electrostaticNot removing the battery between uses causes it to drain in less than a week
IarfenAll logic gates are IC chips?
SpeedEvilIarfen: No.
flybackyour qudescent current electrostatic is *CANUCKED**CANUCKED**CANUCKED**CANUCKED*
electrostaticPiss poor EE, tried 2 units, both have issues
IarfenWhich are the common formats?
electrostaticThank your for your erudite and timely response, Sir Flyback.
flybackyeah thx
bongofurylarfen, diodes or transistors
electrostaticMaybe a really small button switch...
SpeedEvilelectrostatic: have you actually measured it and ensured it's not a faulty cell
enriqfor stability in feedback, should I look for <90 degrees at 0db or >0db?
electrostaticYes, multiple brands, fresh from the box. Other users reporting the same issue
Iarfenbongofury: you're saying that there are logic gates which are diodes or transistors, or you're saying that there're diodes or transistors that are ICs?
SpeedEvilIarfen: see the abvoe video. Lego can be logic too.
LuminaxWkit's the first monday after a semi-long(9 days) holidays... and I didn't sleep last night >_>
LuminaxWkthe triumvirate
electrostaticI bought it early in its lifecycle due to there older designs having good reviews
electrostaticApparently something got cocked io in their design team
LuminaxWkIarfen: depends on what you meant by 'IC'
LuminaxWkalthough if you're talking specifically about specific standardized voltage level digital logic gates, then yes, they're all 'ic' 'chips'
bongofuryIarfen - IC's integrate components into a single package
bongofurythat's what the i stands for
electrostaticAlso, like I said, I can get a month or more out of a single battery if I remember to remove it after each use
electrostaticBut inevitably I forget, then I need to buy a new one lol
LuminaxWkelectrostatic: what circuit is that, then? I joined the conversation late in
LuminaxWknot to mention I'm half asleep ;)
MjrTom"Integrated Circuit"
electrostaticA wahoo tickr x heart rate monitor
electrostaticIt's one of the real ones that straps to your chest and measures your heart voltage
LuminaxWkeh... kinda like those ECG pads ?
electrostaticIt's down to 2.5/5 on apple and 3.5/5 on amazon due to the issues I've mentioned
MjrTomharvest power from people, like on Matrix
LuminaxWkpeople are poor power plant MjrTom
electrostaticYa, like that, only it connects to your phone and lets you see as you run and save wirkouts
LuminaxWkbovine generate power better
MjrTomif it's good enough for The Matrix, it's good enough for his device ...
LuminaxWkelectrostatic: and it's separately powered by... AA? AAA ?
LuminaxWkMjrTom: it's NOT good enough for The Matrix... otherwise there would be NO movie
electrostaticBy a 3v 2032 coin cell
MjrTomLuminaxWk: were you born with no sense of humor, or did you work at it?
LuminaxWkMjrTom: early morning ripposte... I need to keep myself awake
restorerI'm terrible at breadboarding
restorerit's rare a design works
MjrTomLuminaxWk: nah - go back to sleep and stay that way
electrostaticIt has a soft wake feature that I think is killjng it
LuminaxWkoh how I wish I could
MjrTomLuminaxWk: there's lots of ways you can. Learn to google; you can find the info you need there
restorerbut! the LED tape sticks much better after cleaning the wall with rubbing alcohol and using anchors at both ends
electrostaticThe thing is, other than that it actually works great for the price.
LuminaxWkelectrostatic: what kind of MCU?
electrostaticIdk, haven't cracked that side of it open
LuminaxWkwait, this is a finished product that you wanted to tweak?
electrostaticIt's probably one of them fancy Bluetooth integrated ones, though
electrostaticYes, it's a finished product. I bought it
LuminaxWkI should probably google that brand first... fitness related product eh
electrostaticIt's $100 to get a better one, but I'm in money saving mode
LuminaxWkhmmm it's probably too much work to profile the power consumption of that device in various modes
electrostaticTheir previous devices had good reviews, and the price was right at $80, but something got a bit cocked up
LuminaxWkTickr @ 50 euros...
LuminaxWkif you bought it new you could probably try exchanging for new unit
LuminaxWkfor a device that's designed to work on CR2032, that's a poor battery life
electrostaticI already rma'd the first and got a new one that is even more broken
electrostaticAlthough the didn't ask for the old back
electrostaticSo now if have 2 shit devices
electrostaticIf I pay for a new one, it will be a different brand
LuminaxWkgreat! pick the shittest one and tear it apart
LuminaxWkprobably all gunked up inside though...
LuminaxWkyay my AliExpress package arrived at 'swap office'
electrostaticNot a bad idea, but I want to get the one that just has battery issues squared away first
electrostaticI actually use it for working out, I like to hit max heart rate
peepsalotdamn this light looks pretty sweet for the cost
electrostaticBut I'm also almost 40 so knowing I'm not killing myself is a bonus
peepsalotlookin to replace the front light on my house, the sensor on mine has been busted up and still kinda works if you stand waving your arms and jumping in front of it for a few seconds, but that's a bit impractical
electrostaticReplace it with a fully trained guard gnome
LuminaxWkhow does it monitor your heart rate anyway? electrodes touching your skin or something?
LuminaxWkcheck the brochure/manual and see the typical usage scenario and battery life etc
electrostaticYup, one on right side for baseline, one over your heart for picking up the signal
LuminaxWkand then lists all the known modes/possible modes of operation it has/might have so you can try to pinpoint the power-monger
electrostaticAccording to their support the are shocked, nay SHOCKED, that it isn't lasting months
blighthi guys
peepsalotelectrostatic, its not for security, more like so i'm not tripping and falling when I walk around to and fro the driveway at night
LuminaxWkI gather it uses bluetooth/wireless to communicate with your smartphone ?
blightmy lung hurts a bit but i still can't stop smoking
electrostaticBut they are full of it, because others are having the same issue
electrostaticYes, bluetooth
electrostaticI'm guessing it's something like this, only a generic Chinese version.
electrostaticThat boats 8 bucks wholesale and contains the ADC and processor as well as the txrx
electrostaticAnd 128kb of flash
flybackand a aes engine
flybackif it's like their 8051 based one
blighthiiiiii guys
electrostaticPeepsalot: well that may be true, but now my mind is thinking "Guardin' Gnome"
electrostaticAlthough I'm not sure what it is yet, I'm sure there is a product there lol
krizoekhow many here know about the backdoor subroutines implemented in commecial products/closed hardware like intel and amd?
JFK911thats not a "backdoor" that's for "management"
JFK911wink wink
krizoekindeed, big business
bongofurykrizoek everything is backdoored
hjfso i gave up on the eprom programmer
hjftoo many wires for it to work reliably
hjf pic related
bongofuryhjf - not enough pins?
bray90820Would it be ok to use a 24 volt 1.1 amp power adapter on something that originally took a 24 volt 1 amp power adapter
hjfbongofury: no. shitty jumper wires make for unreliable contact
hjfbray90820: yes you can use any adapter as long as it's exactly 24V and 1A or higher. not lower amps or different voltage
bongofurywell, get good jumpers! :D
hjfbongofury: either that or i fried the eprom with too high Vpp
bongofuryhope not
bray90820Ok thanks
LoshkiWhen I worked for a living, installing a backdoor was grounds for instant dismissal, and the products were tested, fairly exhaustively, both by hand and automation, to the point where I'm reasonably sure the hardware, at least, could not generate meaningful network traffic undetected. Such assurances aren't cheap, however.
Bird|otherboxyeah -- it's a convenience vs. security tradeoff from a remote admin perspective. most of those sorts of admin features aren't intended to be exposed to an untrusted network to begin with
LoshkiAlso, nobody tests $5 hardware the way $50,000 hardware gets tested. On the other hand, lots more users of the cheap stuff, so maybe it balances out.
krizoekwe need better open hardware computers
Loshkikrizoek: I agree, but hardware needs so much support from software, and is so much harder to suborn, that I feel the problem is not as pressing as people make it out to be.
krizoekand cellphones
SpeedEvilI note that I have a several year old 'typical' cellphone.
SpeedEvilIt has one user-accessible CPU core.
SpeedEvilIt has around twelve CPU cores that can in principle be reprogrammed.
krizoeklinux is the answer Loshki
SpeedEvilBut the user does not have access to.
SpeedEvilNone of these eleven other cores can run linux.
Loshkikrizoek: an increasingly popular choice, I understand
krizoekor menuetOS
SpeedEvil(wifi, SIM card, SD card, internal SD card, two in modem, ...
krizoekis it openhardware SpeedEvil ?
SpeedEvilNearly nothing is, if you look.
ldhi guys!!!!!
krizoekthats the problem
SpeedEvilI think it's safe to say there are exactly 0 open hardware phones.
krizoekwhy offer free software, or work on making drivers for closed hardware?
ldim trying to design a radio communications encoding/decodign strategy!!!
SpeedEvilBecause there is often no choice.
ldis a complex floating point sparse matrix multiply (like by a ldpc check matrix but not in binary!!!) expensive?
SpeedEvilI'm unsure what you mean by that
krizoekwhat about openmoko in this case SpeedEvil ?
ldmultiplication by a very sparse but structured 20,000*10,000 complex matrix
SpeedEvilkrizoek: It was more open than many, the modem was still closed though
SpeedEvilld: I think it's probably safe to say 'yes'.
SpeedEvilkrizoek: GPS was also closed, as was BT
RoChessSpeedEvil, Fairphone is, even made it to v2
krizoekwonder if beagleboard have open hardware modem
SpeedEvilwait - did it have BT?
krizoekoh my
SpeedEvilRoChess: I have real doubts.
LoshkiIf you (a manufacturer) want the latest, bleeding edge hardware in your phone, so it will sell like crazy, you have to commission it, and whoever supplies the hardware has a vested interested in you being able to run it, so you will buy more. You have to give the driver away to sell the hardware.
SpeedEvilRoChess: Every single CPU core on the phone runs open-source code?
SpeedEvil does not mention anything about the software at all
ldSpeedEvil: but it sparse!!
SpeedEvilEthically sourced has _nothing_ to do with open source
RoChessSpeedEvil, i guess their main push is conflict-flee hardware, but supposedly it is open as well, no mention on software though
SpeedEvilld: FP is always going to be considerably more expensive than integers
SpeedEvilld: why are you using FP, not integer?
ldSpeedEvil: because if we do integer then we have to develop an approximation algorithm (belief propogation if you are familiar with it)
ldSpeedEvil: and in particular that algorithm has to handle joint distributions over sets like {1,...,256}^20
ldSpeedEvil: which is basically impossible
SpeedEvilld: FP has an exponent and a mantissa. This means it has considerably less precision over a defined range.
SpeedEvilParallel multiplies are never, ever going to be cheap, without special hardware, in which case they will be expensive in purchase, and possibly power cost
SpeedEvilSometimes this doesn't matter, and it's OK to have $100K worth of GPU/FPGA hooked to your antenna
SpeedEvil - related.
ldits multiplication with an ldpc matrix
SpeedEvilI am fairly sure that FP will eliminate any possible hardware speedups, meaning you will need as many FP operations as multiplies.
Ahmed90Is there a thing to do USB to USB (both hosts) communication? (like the arduino UART over usb)?
RoChessAhmed90, you mean like -- ?
Ahmed90RoChess, yes something like that but for Serial comunication
SpeedEvilld: In other words, all bit operations become FP operations, and now use ~20000 times the hardware
gurkiSpeedEvil: what stops you from building very large simd blocks?
SpeedEvilNothing, except expense.
SpeedEvilAnd physical realisation costs.
gurkigiven that its a sparse matrix this can actually be kinda fast for kinda "few" gates
gurkihe never defined sparse
gurkiso it might just be like 100ish mults
gurkiheck some stm32 can do that in no time ;)
SpeedEvilld: details matter. Total number of multiplies, how often.
gurki(given u actually have a sparse matrix format ... else hf fitting stuff in ram ^^)
SpeedEvilIt may vary from a $0.37 to a $3B solution
SpeedEvil(or more of course)
MjrTomSpeedEvil: is that virtual EHT optical? radio? I'm sure the yt will explain eventually, but I'd like to know asap :)
SpeedEvilMjrTom: millimeter wave
SpeedEvilthree mm?
Ahmed90also is there a thing like.. 2 pre defined/hardcoded wifi/wireless dongles to act as a P2P connection between 2 devices?
SpeedEvilAnyway - ridiculous baseline when considering ~8000km or so diameter interferometer
SpeedEvilAhmed90: you could use ESP8266 modules or whatever.
HrdwrBoBthere's a zillion ways to skin that cat
MjrTom8,000km, or more like 12,742 km baseline?
Ahmed90SpeedEvil, i know but i only need to connect A to B for maintainance to executing commands and have plenty of usb connections, only issue is that both master and slave have USB as HOST only :/
MjrTomnow, if they had elements on the moon also ...
Ahmed90sorry i mean usb Ports*
SpeedEvilAhmed90: just add a couple of usb-serial, and done.
Ahmed90SpeedEvil, usb to serial <-> serial to usb ?
SpeedEvilAnything else will need software suppoer
SpeedEvil(if it supports USB serial)
DoYouKnowACTION here
Ahmed90SpeedEvil, isnt that a dirty hack xD?
DoYouKnowhow can you induce a negative resistance resistance region transiently in an external material?
Ahmed90well.. i can pre config any software i need but not during mentainance
restorerI can buy one USB charger that will meet my needs
DoYouKnowor is there no publically known way?
SpeedEvilAhmed90: BT?
restoreror for the same price, I can buy 2 or 3 knock-off varieties and open them up
Ahmed90SpeedEvil, its an option but am not sure about security
Ahmed90pairing etc..
zhanxsomeone get that man a sandwich fast
R3GT1Cwhat’s the difference between using a mosfet and a resistor in this level shifter circuit? The mosfet is stuck in the on state since the gate is connected to the LV line, so it’s basically just a constant resistance, no?
crttemple os
SpeedEvillevel shifter isn't it?
gurkiAhmed90: youre not doing this via lan because ...?
R3GT1CI’m trying to understand what a level shifter is doing based off of this circuit
R3GT1Cit seems like it’s just separating the voltage lines
SnertIt's providing level shifting.
Ahmed90gurki, lan may be in use
Snertfrom an unspecified lower voltage to an unspecified higher voltage.
gurkiAhmed90: revolutionary news:
gurkiyou can have two connections on a single lanport
Ahmed90gurki, orly ? but the network can be isolated there is no router/switch/hub
R3GT1CWhen you say it’s level shifting, I’m not sure exactly what you mean. From what I can see it’s just separating two voltage lines
Snertgoogle level shifter.
Snertread the docs that come with that sparkfun level shifter board.
gurkiAhmed90: certainly it can be. but why would it be just to connect the pcs via usb just a second later
gurkithis doesnt make any sense
gurkiu could even have another management network using usb to lan interfaces
gurkiwould make more sense than this usbserial mess
gurkibut considering most servers have two lanports anyway nowadays ...
Mikeeetwo lan ports and a rj45 com port that prevents you from hooking shit up blind
gurkiMikeee: sounds like hp :P
Mikeeepretty much any noncustom server nowadays
Ahmed90gurki, A is master with a control software and B is server like PC with 1 lan and control interface (software) the issue is lan can be hooked to internet and cant be disconnected and the user can be too dumb to configure a network or even enter an IP address :(
R3GT1COhh. Snert what I said before was wrong. It’s not always on. I thought LV was a power line, but it can go high and low. When LV goes low, then the right side gets pulled down to LV
Ahmed90thats why am looking for zero config plug and play solution :)
gurkiyou will not find a solution thats gonna work completely out of the box. usb serial stuff mightwillneed drivers.
gurkithe safest shot really is sth using lan
Ahmed90gurki, i can pre config any drivers i want just not the user
gurkiif you can pre config anything i dont get ur point ...
gurkiyou can enable an ssh/rdp server on that users machine and do $stuff
gurki(i have no idea how macs are remote controlled but im sure there is sth)
Ahmed90gurki, am limited by hardware ports .. and internet/network may not be available so am lookig for direct connection
gurkihow is a direct connection any different from using the lan connection?
gurkiyou need a cable. between two pcs.
gurkisame for lan and usb serial
gurki(switches might apply)
Snertone has an ip address, the other doesn't.
gurkihe said he can preconfigure them
gurkiso we can assume a sane setup.
Snertone is an ethernet node, the other one is not.
gurkihe stated the user has internet
Ahmed90gurki, because the lan port maybe already hooked up to something.. only way is to get usb lan adapters i guess
gurkiso it hops across soem gateway
gurkiif you want it seperate for some reason i dont understand i still think the sanest solution are theese usb lan adapters.
Viper-7fuu composer, that was stressful
gurkitalking composer ...
gurkiACTION heads back to his piano.
Ahmed90gurki, i get your point totally i was going for lan to lan but then i was told the lans will be busy >.< not sure if usb to lan adapters are available locally tho :|
Viper-7work crap - installing a php html to pdf package, MUST be installed using the composer package manager, no direct download offered - ok fine
gurkiAhmed90: "busy"
gurkiure aware how nuts this must sound right? ^^
Viper-7so i do the "composer install blah" on the server, and it starts downloading
Viper-7followed by "Deleting CMS", "Deleting Framework", "Deleting Themes", etc
Ahmed90Viper-7, which html to pdf lib are you using? :P
Viper-7i normally use wkhtmltopdf, coz its awesome, but didnt have that option on this server (heavily locked down windows server)
Ahmed90Viper-7, that deleting is cleanup before update not actually delete :P you know that right?
Viper-7so i tried fpdf, and that gave horrible results, so i tried spipu/html2pdf, and it deleted half my application
Viper-7Ahmed90: it actually deleted them
Viper-7the system couldnt handle being updated, i didnt want that
Viper-7the code isnt compatible with the latest version of the framework
R3GT1Cwhat kind of shit package deletes important things on update? lol
Viper-7thankfully while i had customizations to the default theme, unlike most normal projects i wasnt actually using those changed templates anymore, and was running entirely from templates within my modules
Viper-7so although it did delete a bunch of files that i can never recover, thankfully i dont need them anymore
Ahmed90Viper-7, btw wkhtmltopdf is available on windows also with composer directly you just need to give it file access perrmission
Viper-7it seems simple, but i've tried on windows server before and it needed all sorts of odd crap setup, i got it working but it was a mission
Viper-7wasnt prepared to go through all that again for a simple report
Viper-7now i may :P
Ahmed90yep :P dooeet
Viper-7php wkhtmltopdf (from composer) relies on wkhtmltopdf and wkhtmltoimage, both of which must be already setup on your server - and those require old versions of the VC++ runtimes - part of the install of which you cant do unless you're an administrator
Viper-7the MinGW versions should work, but last i tried those windows server had issues with them too
j4ckcomPOCSAG <— what is it?
CasperI'll give an example soon
Casperat the next "diii dooooo krkrkrkrkrkrkrkrkrkrkrkrkrkrkrkrkrkr"
Casper... of course it have to be quiet...
Casper... D'OH
CasperI'm on the wrong antenna
Casper... or am I?
Casperyeah wrong antenna
Casperthat explain the non-decode and lack of signals
pokmoI'm building a new pc and wondering if it'd be a good idea to skimp on the PSU. I have a 14yo 430w PSU that seems to still work. Would it be a good idea to reuse it?
pokmoWould an old PSU somehow damage the new components?
Casperthe powersupply is the most important part of the system
pokmoCasper yeah
Casperif it die, it can kill everything that is connected to it
Casperwhat brand?
restorerand really old PSUs like that may have components (especially caps) on the edge of failing
pokmoBut if it still gives power, what damages would
pokmoIt cause
pokmoCasper Antec
Casperdon't trust it
restorerpokmo: if it blows, it could give all kinds of "power" to everything
pokmoI found this last week in the antic
Casperwhen it fail you have an high chance of killing your pc
Caspersmartpower I guess?
MjrTomthe $ savings in improved efficiency over the first year of use may pay for a new PSU
restoreroh, a Found PSU is even more suspect, but at least it hasn't been running that long
Viper-7i've had a primary to secondary short in a power supply kill the motherboard, cpu, graphics card, and everything that was connected to the USB bus
Casperantec don't have a proper safety
pokmoNot sure. Doesn't seem to say
CasperViper-7: DEER? E-Data? L&C?
pokmoI used it back in school days
restorerI had a Fortron PSU blow very loudly - fortunately didn't seem to damage anything
pokmo14yrs ago
Viper-7Casper: not sure what brand it was, not a big name
pokmoHaven't touched it since
Casperpokmo: I'ld avoid it
pokmoI tried powering on the entire old pc last night
Casperbut if you insist, open it up
MjrTomI would not use a 14yo PSU unless I had no practical choice
Casperand check the capacitors...
pokmoOne of the caps in the MOBI started sizzling 5s in
Casperbut avoid it
pokmoThe aluminium oxide was exposed
pokmoSo i just salvaged the PSU
pokmoOK I'll heed the advice and get a new one
Viper-7pokmo: use it as a bench supply instead :P
codepython7771 for bldc motors, if one uses a cheap esc, can one get rotor position from it?
flybackACTION bites aaa| 
LuminaxWkyay got my PCBs from OSH
LuminaxWk$7.25 for 3 PCBs of DC-DC converter based on MC34063, 25mm x 35mm
LuminaxWksort of expensive... but worth it
ace4016doesn't sound expensive
ace4016perhaps things have drastically dropped in price
Viper-710x 50x50mm for $7.99
Flea86Viper-7: o/ How did your lid go?
Viper-7still a bit orange, but im happy with it :D
Flea86wow that turned out great
Evidloare 50 ohm 1206 resistors really over $1 each on digikey?
Viper-7of course now i discover im out of small self tapping screws so i cant assemble it properly yet
Viper-7but hey :P
EvidloI've got to be searching wrong:
Viper-7thankfully all the parts inside the case seem to hold there by themselves, even tho there are screw mounts for the battery holder and pcb
Viper-7everything fits really nicely inside the case, almost like it was made for them! :P
Mad7ScientistI'm buying tape deck repair belts from They have a minimum order of $25 or else they add a fee and It's $9 for shipping using the USPS $3 first class package rate. Does anyone need anything from this electronics supplier like a single belt or something? I'm short of the minimum order. I can get whatever small thing it is to you. :)
Mad7ScientistSend me a PM if you are interested
Flea86Evidlo: Does it have to be *exactly* 50 Ohm? 49.9 Ohm resistors are 0.10
EvidloI thought 50 ohms was a common value
Mad7Scientist47 is common
Mad7ScientistWhat's the formula for getting 10 e series steps from 1 to 10?
Flea86Yes, that's inline with EIA standard iirc
Flea86Viper-7: And that's the beauty of 3D printing right there
Viper-7_unreal_: i saw it before, what about it?
_unreal_oh ok.....
_unreal_I think it may help my motor thing
_unreal_have not had a chance to really sit down and look at it
Viper-7well your controller takes care of the majority of that for you
Viper-7so it doesnt quite apply imo
Mad7ScientistDoes anyone know where to get belts for VCRs and tape players at reasonable prices? I need supplier that lists sizes.
_unreal_ya the PWM would need to be stripped out
Viper-7if you want to roll it all yourself, talk to catphish when he's around :P
Viper-7he's been having fun building a 3 phase motor driver for like 50+kW
_unreal_how big is the motor?
Viper-7chunky (electric car)
codepython7771does anyone know what is the wattage of these motors: (or where I can find more specs on these motors)?
Mad7ScientistViper-7, is he using bipolar transistors or fets?
Viper-7IGBT modules
Mad7Scientistoh ok
Viper-7so.. both :D
Mad7Scientistwhat voltage is the DC input?
Viper-7not sure exactly, battery array somewhere around the 200V mark i think
Mad7ScientistHe's not using thyristor modules?
Mad7Scientist200V is really low for 50kW
Mad7Scientist250 Amps
Mad7ScientistThat's MOSFET territory
Viper-7i think its actually like 60kW all up, but thats like 4 motors each with 15kW drivers
Mad7ScientistIRFB260N 50A 200 Volt
Viper-7i was helping him more with his early prototyping of the idea, when using a small 200W motor, as for what he's running now im not sure tbh
_unreal_4 motors? I thouht most elec car's where 1-2 mtoors
Mad7Scientist$2 each
_unreal_driving a differential
Viper-7these are hub motors driving each wheel directly afaik
Flea86evidlo: Just so you know, 49.9 Ohms is a standard E96 value.
_unreal_ahh hub'ers
kevtrisI got this old-ass calculator working finally
kevtrisit outputs vector graphics to a CRT, but the CRT part wasn't working so I used my scope in XY mode
kevtrisbottom row has "123456789" on it
Viper-7Flea86: or just use 2x 100 ohms in parallel :P
Flea86kevtris: So you've made ein friden ayy? :D
kevtrisI bought one that was broke. lol
Flea86aha lol
kevtrisI got the CRT working last night. unfortunately the seller packed it poorly (read: not at all) and it sustained some damage
kevtrisa cardboard box and a cut up foam cooler is not enough packing to send a 40 pound machine
Flea86Viper-7: That's too much work.. unless you need better accuracy for the $$ ofc :P
Flea86kevtris: Probably not.
Flea86kevtris: At least someone didn't put a forklift finger through the box.. ;
kevtrisyep most definitely not enough
kevtriswell teh calculator was sticking out the side of the box
kevtrisand it was so bad fedex threw the box into a bigger box
Flea86kevtris: Maybe he found it stuffy in there
Viper-7Flea86: probably easier than sourcing E96 series values :P
kevtrisso the calculator was moving around inside the box, then that box was moving around inside a bigger one. total packing fail. I knew something was wrong when I moved the box and it clunked
Flea86Viper-7: heh. I think you'll find 1% tolerance resistors to be plentiful ;)
Flea86kevtris: Bummer about the case damage on such a historic item
kevtrisyeah. trying to get some cash out of the seller for it
Flea86Right on.
kevtrisbut the thing works now at least. the CRT is all wobbly though
kevtrisbut I'm pretty sure it's magnetic interference on the CRT from the transformers. I removed the metal shield from the tube for testing
Flea86mechanically or trace-wise?
kevtristurning the tube results in it changing
kevtristhe lines oscillate in an oval. it's really weird
kevtrisif I turn the tube the lines will hit each other
Flea86built in ADHD resetter :)
Flea86ACTION runs
kevtristhere's no wobble on the scope trace, and that's direct from the deflection amps
kevtrisso pretty sure it's magnetic in nature
kevtrisif it was ripple, it'd move in a diagonal axis only as both channels would be affected the same
Flea86Still easier to diagnose/repair than a modern LCD panel imho :)
kevtrismore satisfying too
Flea86I bet.
kevtristhe CRT problem was dumb. just a bad diode in the voltage multipliers. it has a little transformer driven at 12V and chopped with a transistor
kevtristhen a 12 stage multiplier
Viper-7dunno, diagnose/repair process for a modern LCD is pretty simple: yep, its fucked - order replacement
kevtrisit's made up as two 6 stage ones with the transformer in the middle which is kinda dumb since the transformer will ride at 1500V or so
EvidloMad7Scientist: try this formula: a*(b/a)^((n-1)/(N-1)). where a=1, b=10, n=[1..10], N=10
Flea86Viper-7: That's cheating :P
kevtrisno it's open up monitor, replace caps, if that doesn't fix it throw it out
kevtrisseems to be cap problems a lot though but they usually are domed
karstensragewhat kind of connector is this?
Flea86kevtris: Another nice thing about that unit - it was made to be serviceable.
kevtrisfixed a bad flat panel TV with... a piece of toilet paper
kevtrisflea: looooool. you'd think
kevtristhis was a HUGE pain to work on
Viper-7would love to know whats wrong with the dodgy tv we're using here atm
kevtrisgod I fought it every step of the way. there's no connectors really, everything is soldered on. wires and all
Flea86kevtris: I probably should temper that comment with the fact they were fighting the tyranny of numbers in such a confined volume :)
kevtrisremoving the power supply board to work on it would be extremely difficult. the wires are soldered to turrets on the bottom, and there's wires on turrets on the top too
Viper-7half the time when you turn it on either it scatters the image all across the display, or displays complete garbage as a static image and slowly fades up in brightness, showing new details and washing out old ones
kevtrisgetting some of the screws in was hard because there's other stuff in the way. I fought for 15 minutes just to get the two screws for the keyboard back in
Viper-7its rather trippy to watch, but not exactly useful
restorerI need to build some kind of frame for my fans
Viper-7doesnt seem heat related, no caps are bulged, i've scoped all the power rails and they're as solid as a rock
kevtriskeyboard's like 2-3 pounds on its own and you have to hold it up against the frame and try to install screws, getting them around 3 pieces of metalwork in the perfect spot to prevent you screwing them in by hand or a screwdriver
Flea86kevtris: I tip my hat off to you sir, you have more serviceman patience than I :)
Viper-7but then despite all those issues, the other half of the time, it'll work fine and run for hours on end without issue
kevtrisit was dumb how they designed it IMO. you can't even test the PCBs without extender cards, and I was going to make those until it turned out to be a mundane problem of a wire came off (and then the CRT issue)
Flea86kevtris: I bet project deadlines and money came into it.
Viper-7ACTION slaps restorer with a 3d printer
restorerViper-7: yep... much down the line
Flea86Viper-7: Did you try re-seating all of the flex connectors?
restorerfor now my primary building material is cardboard ;D
restorerI'll probably upgrade to some kind of fiberboard or something else cheap for this
Viper-7Flea86: yeah i stripped it right down and rebuilt it - it worked fine for a day after that, then not at all the next day
restorerand a hot glue gun :D :D
Flea86Viper-7: Weird.
Viper-7neither heat nor percussive maintenance seems to effect it
Flea86Did you scope the supply rails again when it was DOA?
kevtrislol percussive maintenance
Flea86and lol
Viper-7not yet, its a pain to strip down, done that twice and both times while lying on the bench i couldnt get it to reproduce the fault
Viper-7tried for like 4 hours the second time
Flea86kevtris: You'd be surprised how satisfying of a repair that can be xD
Flea86Viper-7: Give all the PCBs a quick check under a magnifier.. look for any bad solder joints
Flea86extremely rare that the PCB itself could fail electrically :p
karstensrageany ideas?
Viper-7dont have a magnifier, but will give it another look over later
Viper-7karstensrage: mate-n-lok ?
Viper-7 -ish
karstensragehmm interesting
karstensragethanks Viper-7
JFK911Guess which is in Viper-7's stash
Flea86JFK911: If they're faking the 555, they'll fake anything!
Viper-7JFK911: actually pretty sure all mine are legit - i havent bought any since i discovered china:P
JFK911Flea86: Yeah this is amazing
Viper-7less amazing than the atmega328 fakes :P
HrdwrBoBit just seems stupid though
HrdwrBoBbecause if you sold it as a legitimate product
HrdwrBoBit would be fine
JFK911almost applied at ses
Flea86HrdwrBoB: They make more money through rebranding it. Not stupid just criminal/immoral :)
LuminaxWki havent bought any since i discovered china:P <-- quote of the day ?
Flea86an underrated comment at least
JFK911viper-7 will grab an arduino for timing nowadays
Flea86nah, he'd sooner grab a PIC :)
LuminaxWkapology in advance to all arduino users out there, but I think it's overrated
JFK911Flea86: oh true true
LuminaxWkFlea86: I'd grab a PIC, too
Flea86LuminaWk: Nothing wrong with PICs they can do a lot too. Arduino is a great idea that was imperfectly implemented.
Flea86from a hw aspect mainly
LuminaxWkLuminaxWk: I didn't say there's anything wrong with PICs
HrdwrBoBthing is
HrdwrBoByou can keep an arduino on the shelf
LuminaxWkI'm a PIC fan myself
HrdwrBoBand use it for timing.. or whatever
HrdwrBoBand just plug it in
HrdwrBoBa 555 you can ONLY use for timing
HrdwrBoBand requires more work
HrdwrBoBobviously it doesn't scale
LuminaxWkHrdwrBoB: I have 4 PICs modules already mapped out and pin-routed to be breadboard compatible
LuminaxWkcomplete with a 'skeleton library' sets
LuminaxWksort of a 'PICDuino' if you will
LuminaxWkACTION cringes
LuminaxWkthere, let's register that name
eeriegeekfrom of course
Flea86eeriegeek: heh
Flea86Also "TempleOS uses the 640x480 screenmode, just the way god intended" xD
Flea86This comment made my day
restorereeriegeek: don't think it would be confused with ? ;P
LuminaxWkPICCadillo sounds good
restorercochinita tomorrow, actually
LuminaxWkfor modular goodness
Viper-7pic n mix :P
LuminaxWkPICHard... exploring space on 8-bits!
Flea86LuminaxWk: Going where no ALU on steroids has gone before..
Viper-7interrupting the universe
LuminaxWkPICHard : more DATA(R)
ChrisauHi all. Can anyone help me understand what the diode is doing here? -- Some sort of bypass?
Flea86I cannot recall if the first ever pic even had a stack or interrupts!
Flea86Chrisau: It's there to protect the input of ZU2..
LuminaxWkclamping diode
Flea86^ This
ChrisauSo if someone applies >5V it'll keep it at 5v?
Flea86Well, 5.6v yeah
Flea86or 5.4v depending on diode type xD
LuminaxWkor 5.3V...
LuminaxWkget that knee checked
Flea86LuminaxWk: There are more diode knees than human ones.. ;)
ChrisauIn what scenario does it need protection. If someone applies >5V to the 5V rail at the cathode end of the diode?
ChrisauItll clamp it to 5V?
Flea86Chrisau: Where's the rest of the circuit in question?
Flea86looks cropped
ChrisauYep, Arduino Uno schematic
ChrisauTop right of mega328p
ChrisauTop left*
Kerr-AI got some cabinets to store my stockpile of electronics crap in... and just recently came across an eevblog talking about ESD and he specifically says its very bad to use plain plastic drawers to store electronic components...
Kerr-AHow big of a risk am I running? should I get some sort of antistatic spray?
LuminaxWkKerr-A: get an aluminium wrapper for baking
Flea86Chrisau: I see, well it's there because RESET is an external pin to the GPIO header
LuminaxWkline your drawers with them and make sure they 'connect' to a grounding path
LuminaxWkyes, plastics are very bad for your components, especially if most of your stuffs are CMOS
LuminaxWk...or was it TTL.... anyway, it's just generally bad
LuminaxWkaaaand it's lunch break time
Flea86Not TTL, that's more robust.
LuminaxWksee ya folks in an hour
Kerr-AFirst thing I did was put all my mosfets in =D
Flea86eep lol
ChrisauSo it's in case someone puts >~5V into the RESET pin?
Flea86discrete mosfets are the MOST sensitive to ESD.. :/
crtiy blow
Flea86chrisau: For whatever reason, yes.
Flea86either by misdesign or accident
ChrisauOk great, thanks
Flea86NP :)
Flea86The only devices I've ever zapped through stray ESD on my bench are discrete mosfets
Flea86They usually refuse to work when put into a circuit
Kerr-ANone of the FET's I have bought ever came with ESD protection
Dago^RF stuff is crazy sensitive too due to the extremely low capacitances
Kerr-AI should probably take this more seriously thr
Kerr-Aindividually lining the drawers will take forever and be a pita though
Flea86Kerr-A: Perhaps you should re-purpose said drawers for your resistor collection :3
Kerr-Athen what do I keep my FET's in
archivistantistatic plastic bags
archivistaluminium pill tubes
Kerr-Athat I guess I can do
Kerr-Aso google has turned up some info... fet's often continue to function temporarily after esd damage?!
MikeeeThe holes aren't functional damage
MikeeeESD generally causes "leaks" in the semiconductor which causes damage to the function of the fet
Flea86Mikeee: In particular, the puncturing of the gate dielectric
MikeeeI was trying to be more ELI5
Flea86Mikeee: I wouldn't give my 5 year old any mosfets :P
genewitchi ordered a 12V 0-16.6A outdoor supply
genewitchi also have a 2000W step-up/down transformer shipping
genewitchthe 500W works fine but gets super hot, so bump it up.
genewitchThey'll be useful in a disaster/emergency since i can use my small generators to produce 220 to run a freezer or whatever if i need to
genewitchnow i just gotta find a waterproof enclosure to put all the remote electronics in
Kerr-Alooks like i need one of those
archivisttoo expensive, remember cardboard is made of wood particles (carbon) so is reasonable
archivistsome of mine is in matchboxes
restorerFlambeau... is burning up your components any better than ESD? ;P
restorerdo food-type mylar bags function well as anti-ESD bags?
Flea86restorer: Those aren't ESD protective
restorergood thing the only thing I'm storing in one are high-power Schottkeys then!
restorerI also have one of those pink bags that some 555s shipped in
Dago^yeah mylar is just a regular dielectric by itself, the ESD bags are metallized mylar
kodingkittyI have a driver to test. For that I need to create a USB dummy usb device to test my driver. That driver have usb endpoints HID interface and other two bulk channels. Is that Teensy board is enough to implement this functionality ?
kodingkittyAnybody done something like that before.
restorerer, I guess Mylar is a brand name of BoPET according to 'pedia, but I don't think I've ever NOT seen it metallized
kodingkittyI know that I can definitely do this with the OTG USB gadget , but using a arm 7000 MHX is not a over engineer for that ?
restorerit's the metallized kind that's used for food storage
restorerI don't know which sides are metallized, though, or how much that matters
Dago^restorer: overhead projector films :)? those are often non-metallized mylar
Dago^though not always
restorerI've seen them in a bunch of materials, but never referred to as Mylar - and I haven't heard them called "overhead projector films" since high school!
genewitchit must be easy to print on mylar
genewitchthey're called transparencies, anyhow
genewitchthe overhead sheets
restorerheh, "If it were produced without any additives, the surface of the film would be so smooth that layers would adhere strongly to one another when the film is wound up"
genewitchyou could make a mace out of mylar
genewitchjust roll it up tight
genewitchsome form of polearm with a long enough sheet to roll up
restorerif it weren't metallized :)
Dago^I worked at a warehouse when I was young and we used to make (hard) baseballs off the cling film :)
restorerhuh, also roasting bags and aluminum cans
genewitchand potato chip bags i assume
restorerand coffee bags, and probably every foil-looking plastic bag
restoreror many types
restorerI guess there are some that feel different
restorerKettle brand chips probably uses met.mylar-on-paper
restorerthey have that weird bag that feels like paper on the outside, but is standard plastic-foil on the inside
Kerr-Awell I ordered some ESD bags
Kerr-Aim thinking I might get conductive foam (the pink shit) and stick my ic's into it
archivistI got some of the black foam for mine
Kerr-AI had some chips come in it... now i know why
Kerr-AI remember ages ago when I worked on compuers in my teens someone told me not ot set computer motherboards onto ESD bags because they are conductive
LuminaxWkKerr-A: conductive foam still won't do jack-shit if you stick 'em into plastic drawers, just saying
Kerr-AI never sufficently questioned that
Kerr-Awell conductive foam would give a conducting path between the pins of a FET?
restorerpink is dissipative, black is conductive
Kerr-Aor do I like, need to ground the conductive foam
LuminaxWkmost plastic drawers by the nature of their chemical composition, are great charge generator/gatherer
LuminaxWkso if you have a conductive foam inside a plastic container, what could happen is, the next time you pick up your IC, your body acts as grounding path and charge surges through the conductive foam, through the IC, to your body
LuminaxWk...that's one likely scenario anyway
LuminaxWkI actually do have surface voltage meter... lemme see... where did I put it...
genewitchLEDs as photon counters, discuss
LuminaxWkbah... QA drawer... scratch that
MikeeeLuminaxWk i would love to see a scenerio where you get to an IC without opening a drawer
Kerr-AWell if all the pins of the IC are electrically connected, it doesn't matter what voltage level they sit at?
Kerr-Aeven if I came in contact with it and there was a discharge
Mikeeealso Kerr-A got it 100%
LuminaxWkMikeee: I ground my acrylic drawer set
LuminaxWkACTION shrugs
Kerr-AMikeee: sorry, ambiguous. I need to ground then or am okay not grounding?
Kerr-AI stated both :p
LuminaxWkI actually have a very violent mood swing when it comes to ESD
LuminaxWksometimes I just don't care, sometimes I'm too paranoid
LuminaxWkKerr-A: most modern devices are ESD protected, in any cases
LuminaxWkas a rule of thumb, you want to keep your $100+ chips on a carefully ESD protected container
LuminaxWkand your $4 for 100 pieces of ICs in whatever container you can get your hands on ;)
Mikeeegrounding means 100% nothing when it comes to esd
Kerr-AMK that's what I thought
Mikeeethe point of ESD is to bring yourself to the same potential as the ICs you pick up
Kerr-ASo I stick the IC's into conductive (black) foam, and make sure to touch the foam first, then pull out the IC I'm about to use?
Mikeeethat'll do
LuminaxWkpull out together with foam I guess
LuminaxWkeasier too :3
Kerr-AI read something about conductive O-rings put around the pins of to-package fets
Mikeeeits unlikely the foam will have such a high charge that you can cause ESD damage through it, but its best to touch it anyway
Kerr-Ato be clipped off after installation
Kerr-Awell if I have a charge
Mikeeeif you have a charge and touch one pin of the IC, every other pin will also see the same charge
Kerr-AAnd I guess I'll do legit esd wrist strap and esd mat for now on too
Mikeeenow if you AND another person were to touch it at the same time and you both had opposing charges...
Mikeeeand you each touched a different pin
Kerr-Awell if I touch one pin and it's not in conductive foam then they arent the same. so long as its plugged into something it should be okay...?
LuminaxWkdissipative vs conductive, yay
LuminaxWk...I don't even have ESD mat on this table ;_;
Mikeeeyeah if its conductive it'll be fine
LuminaxWkmy other work table is fully covered with dissipative mat though
LuminaxWkthe green/black rubber
LuminaxWkor whatever that material is... I think it's EPDM, isn't it :o
Mikeeethe only truly expensive ICs i have are custom made, they're just sandwiched with conductive foam in conductive boxes with esd conductive bags
Kerr-Afor some reason I don't trust ebay.aliexpress to give me legit esd foam
MikeeeKerr-A you can just test for resistance
LuminaxWkI'd be more inclined to trust Ali nowadays
LuminaxWkhe does have the genie...
Kerr-ASpeaking of testing, is there a way to test mosfet's for esd damage/what is the best way to do that
Kerr-AI read some things about products receiving ESD damage and passing testing then failing the customer...
MikeeeYou can sample test
LuminaxWkyou can check its datasheet and test for the near max condition I guess...
Kerr-Aand BTW I have a pack of 100 to-220 FET's that were shipped to me wrapped in food wrap all together. Should I like, submerse them in salt water or something before unwrapping? lol...
Kerr-Asample test?
LuminaxWkcling wrap?
Kerr-Acling wrap.
Mikeeeas in you choose a few units randomly and test them
Mikeeedestructive tests are cheap and easy. it is not cheap to test for ESD damage nondestructively.
Kerr-AAh. What is a destructive test, then?
Kerr-ARaise gate voltage until failure?
LuminaxWkAbsolute Maximum parameters test ?
MikeeeYeah max load test
CasperESD destructive test is basically a capacitor in series with a resistor discharged throught the circuit
Casperthat is the human model test
LuminaxWkah, HBD discharge test
Casperthe capacitor hold enought charge, like your body could hold
Casperthe resistor simulate the body resistance, which limit the current
Dago^full characterization of all FET parameters :-)
Caspercharge, test, charge more, test, repeat until failure
Kerr-AWell. I'm not selling any products so I will probably go without on that. Duely noted that ESD handling is important.
Kerr-AACTION starts shopping for black foam
LuminaxWkit's quite important, but not really life or death level
LuminaxWk...or could it? hmmm
LuminaxWkthose stored charges can be quite nasty at times
LuminaxWkACTION wears ESD shoes with dissipative sole
Kerr-Aand for the record my faith in ebay/aliexpress has been waning. I might pay extra to use a proper supplier in the future purchases. I could have a shit ton of ruined FET's because they shpped in cling wrap, and I would have been better off paying more in the first place.
LuminaxWkthe funny thing is, our factory floor's matting is NOT ESD...
LuminaxWkanyway... back to playing with el Diablo
Kerr-Aok so conductive foam is expensive
Kerr-Alike $3 per drawer expensive
Mikeeeyou don't line drawers, you stick your chips in it
Kerr-AYeah, but I was thinking I would make them drawer sized
Kerr-Acan i use steel wool ;p
LuminaxWkkitchen aluminium foil into styrofoam
Kerr-Ain my mind I see the chip wiggling a little bit and the hole in the aluminium foil opening up so its not connected. then the foam is a great ESD producer.
LuminaxWkit's definitely not a use many time material substitute
LuminaxWkbut for the first insertion, it's quite solid
LuminaxWkthat, or you can just make a few layers of the aluminium foils
batchhow to know if voltage in motorcycle without voltage regulator is AC or DC ?
LuminaxWkvoltage in motorcycle is battery DC
batchwithout battery
batchsuzuki rmx 50cc
LuminaxWkthen it's a filtered rectified AC... in essence DC
batchsome friend of me told me those without battery are 12V AC
LuminaxWkthough I've never scoped them so don't quote me on that
batchLuminaxWk yeah no problemo, thx though
LuminaxWk12V lead acid charges at... what... 13.8? 14.2 ?
batch14 iirc
batchi want to add a battery in the circuit
batchbut idk what i need else
batchsome confidence maybe
LuminaxWkadd another battery ?
LuminaxWknot recommended
batchthere is no battery in the circuit by default LuminaxWk
batchthat model is without battery
batchmakeryear 1998
LuminaxWkhow... does it start ? kick?
batchit does have an electric killswitch
LuminaxWkprobably have some hefty caps for storing the enegy
batchthey should've made electric starter and battery lol
batchmmmh yeah
batchsweet jesus
LuminaxWkthis needs some tidying up >_>
LuminaxWkanyway! in the case of THIS particular schematic, it's mostly chopped up AC
LuminaxWkI don't see any rectifying
batchyeah i love to make it more functional
LuminaxWkif you want to add battery and electric starter first you need to rearrange the schematic by its functional blocks
LuminaxWkoh wait, what am I talking about
LuminaxWkACTION eyes regulator/rectifier at bottom right
LuminaxWkis this newer model ?
batchi made everything on the circuit work again
batchbut i never added a battery in a circuit like this
MatCatcream pies!
LuminaxWksooo the battery goes in after the rectifier and smoothing circuit ...
LuminaxWkactually, take a look at this
LuminaxWkhmmm wait...
batchACTION waiting
LuminaxWkhmmm I forgot the bike brand >_>
batchsuzuki rmx 50cc
LuminaxWkanyway basicall, you add the battery after the regulator/rectifier
batchsmx is ok too
batchah ok ok
LuminaxWkthough you need to make sure that the reg/rect voltage is not exceeding the max charging voltage
batchshouldn't be the problem i think though :p
batchi'll make sure it does not
batchLuminaxWk thankyou so much for the info
batchi found this though
batchACTION has no clue
LuminaxWkSuzuki TS250
genewitchwhoa, there's more entropy sources that i originally considered
genewitch$40 for 10mbit/s is the best price i've found
batchLuminaxWk the friend i told about, he said 12V AC is 6V DC somehow
batchdoes this make sense? cause to me it doesn't
LuminaxWk6V AC is somehow 12V DC, that's correct, in a way
LuminaxWkI forgot what's the calculation formula is >_>
genewitchyou talking about RMS
LuminaxWkbasically, rectified AC gives you a higher DC
LuminaxWkyes, that's it
LuminaxWk1.414 ?
batchgenewitch no it's a moped
genewitchyou're a moped
Dago^yes sinewave peak voltage is RMS * sqrt(2)
genewitchif you plug AC into a battery you're gunna be shocked at what happens next
batchsuzuki RMX
batchnothing about RMS voltages
batchgenewitch well hmm
LuminaxWkbatch: we were talking about RMS voltage calculation
batchok i see now
LuminaxWkso what your friend is saying is, with all due respect, pure bullshit
batchis RMS related in this conversion?
LuminaxWkunless there's a regulator in the middle somewhere
LuminaxWkregardless, they'd usually regulates to 12VDC
LuminaxWkinstead of 6VDC and dumping excess heat in the conversion
LuminaxWkwell...there's that
batchthat's dynamolike?
_abc_Has anyone got a reference on this news item? In German only, can't find the source. Apparently customs authorities in several EU countries have been confiscating counterfeit electronic parts, especially car parts, coordinated by the Dutch, all week ...
LuminaxWkthaaat's the voltage source
_abc_... long?
LuminaxWkpulse width modulation is a method of controlling voltage by varying its duty cycle
nosCould someone explain to me why this circuit is safe? It seems to me like you could get high voltage transients over the 10 puff cap, and with high resistor values like 453k you would have a lot of noise, badly limiting bandwidth if you want to keep oscillations in check and have decent gain. I have trust issues with high voltage feedback, regardless of resistors...
_abc_gotta trust linear to use 0.1% resistors in their schematics :)
_abc_It's an example circuit. "needs more work"
_abc_Such as clamping diodes here and there probably.
nosThat makes sense..
_abc_The 10pF|453k forms a low pass / gain cut element and ADDS stability. Input change speed is already limited by the 10k|470??
LuminaxWk_abc_: I coulda comment if only I could read that article
_abc_LTC6090 applications
_abc_So? Anyone onto this week long confiscation thing?
nosI thought the 10pf/453k was a high pass... Since the cap is a shunt to the resistor.
_abc_Maybe in Dutch? /me pokes the Dutch channel haunters :) Oh smeding is not in.
_abc_ACTION summons bobo1on1 -- hi, know anything about this please? ^
_abc_:) article says "razzia in 12 EU countries, ... falsified electronic parts, ... the parts come from one country" - they do not say which one. I wonder... could it be Somalia? >;)
_abc_No, no, it has to be Ghana. That's where all the ROHS electronics end up from Europe, so they can be ROHS-burned in open pit fires to recover parts and metals.
Dago^I like the statement "manufactured within and outside EU" in some products
Dago^like foodstuffs
Dago^so manufactured... anywhere?
_abc_Dago^: I don't see a problem with that. Here in .ro they HAVE to a) put the country of provenience on all foods b) list all ingredients by % or b.w. and calories.
LuminaxWkdon't you know they manufacture foodstuffs in Venus nowadays ?
_abc_Dago^: so it's less ambiguous. Cue supermarket veggies and fruit where you can see normal veggies from say Greece, .ro, Spain etc., and super perfect looking ones from Holland >;) I call them Philips veggies. When the sky is dark in .nl they mature ...
_abc_... under Philips lightbulbs...
_abc_(they tend to taste like lightbulbs too, i.e. like nothing)
_abc_Perfect looks though. Even the onions rot from the inside so the outside looks perfect till the last shelf day. Must be Monsanto etc.
_abc_"engineered for shelf life". To the detriment of all other qualities, such as, and not only, taste.
acetolinewhich fruits are we talking about?
_abc_In this case, specifically, onions, potatoes, carrots (!), and red bell peppers.
Dago^weed, that perfect vegetable of the closet
acetolineand you know that they are being grown under LED lighting?
_abc_ACTION got some Greek red apples which are about 5 times sweeter than the Dutch ones. Must remember to buy Greek lightbulbs instead of Dutch (Philips) ones >;)
acetolineI didn't know that led-grown vegetables are available on the mass market
_abc_acetoline: Probably Japan has such things, you can get a watermelon there for $10000
_abc_hipster shit
_abc_Also some semicon fabs started growing cabbages in the cleanrooms. Don't ask.
acetolineand even if they were, I'm skeptical that just the LED lighting would make them taste substantially different
acetolineI mean to say that I see no a priori reason why that would be the case
acetolinemaybe it is the case, but it's not obvious why it should be
_abc_I never said it's LED. .nl is not the sunniest of countries in Winter/early Spring, being Northern and on the sea (lots of cloud).
p0g0__abc_: those veggies were dipped in a wax most likely.
p0g0_Tho many are engineered for machine harvesting, like the tomato.
acetolinebut I'm not denying that there is too much emphasis on shelf life
_abc_So when you see aisles of perfect looking out of season "Made in Holland" veggies and fruit, you immediately think of what frequent fliers into Schiphol (Amsterdam) airport, from USA, call "the daylight below as you fly into Schiphol at night, caused ...
_abc_... by the thousands of acres of lit greenhouses"
acetolinebut otoh the alternative is wasting millions of tons of perfectly good food
_abc_Thus the "Philips veggies" idea (lightbulbs...)
p0g0_hmm, self illuminating veggies.
_abc_p0g0_: I assume they do something to the veggies but 1st they select them for perfect aspect.
_abc_p0g0_: I have learned to be wary of such details, will buy pecked etc apples for that reason alone.
acetolinein a world where we are already annihilating the natural world at light speed, I'd much rather have long-shelf-life veggies
p0g0_OLED engineered with the lightning bug luciferase...
acetolinethan veggies that rot and have to be thrown away
_abc_A wrinkle here and there indicates a fruit that presents some interest to birds and insects and is less likely to lead to my untimely death
p0g0_They certainly grade food stuffs and sell the prettiest at a premium
acetolineit's like the thing with ocean-caught vs farmed fish
_abc_acetoline: is it? Going for the natural Mercury, are we?
acetolinea lot of people seem to insist on ocean-caught fish even though it's devastating to the environment
acetolineand yep, they get a lot of mercury too
acetolineand these are otherwise liberal, whole-foods-loving, bleeding hearts
p0g0__abc_: well, whatever you do, stay of the golf courses, those places are beyond belief re fungicides, herbicides, etc.
Johnsenbut my bentley came with golfclub holders
LuminaxWkmercury is good for the formation of your body into Liquid Terminator
LuminaxWkI'LL BE BACK!.... no wait, wrong droid
acetolineone study tested samples of supermarket tuna and found more mercury in them than CFLs
acetolinethere was some variation though
p0g0_mercury meth like crystal meth... gonna kill you quick.
_abc_p0g0_: saw the query?
acetolineugh golf courses
cheaterhow the hell do you install addons in tor browser
cheateri install em, restart, and they're gone again
cheaterthis sucks
p0g0_eh, ooh, ok
_abc_acetoline: That's not a fair comparison. A CFL has ug to mg of Hg in it, bound to an amalgam of metals not unlike that in tooth fillings.
ziongatehello al
acetolinetrue, the mercury in tuna is in organic form, much more deadly
_abc_cheater: you worry me. You cheat, and you are not saying from which country.
_abc_This is very suspect. I will not help you with tor until you say where you are hiding :)
cheaterwhat the fuck _abc_
cheateryou asked yesterday after i left to the kitchen and you flipped out
cheaterwhat is your obsession with this topic
acetolinethe only thing that soothes my heart re golf courses is that I know that in 50 years when there are mass water shortages, rich golfing f__koffs are going to be beaten and lynched
cheaterlike don't you have /whois on your client or something
acetolinemaybe climate change isn't all bad
_abc_ /whois hiding behind a cheater nick
cheaterand what's with the tin foil hat conspiracy theories anyways
ziongateq: to explain some electronic basics to childrens, what kinf of analogy for current and voltage should be fine ? (water and tubes someone uses is not the proeper way)
_abc_Oh you are not cloaked for a change. Jawohl, I can see where your... possibly virtual host is :)
acetolineziongate: why isn't water and tubes appropriate?
synx508there are no good analogies.
LuminaxWkziongate: why is it not proper? or what is not proper about it ?
acetolineit's as good as any analogy
cheaterseriously abc wtf
LuminaxWkprobably it's presented wrong ?
cheaterthat's just creepy
LuminaxWkvoltage potential is like water height difference
LuminaxWkthe higher the tank, the higher the voltage potential difference
_abc_cheater: relax, you're the one cloaked all the time.
LuminaxWkthus being able to push more water 'current'
ziongatebecouse generally a thicker tube is explained as a resistance, while there inside the current for fluid is major btw
LuminaxWkthen being limitted by the pipe 'resistor'
acetolinethe hydraulic analogy is honestly better than drawing little pictures of anthropomorphic electrons with smiley faces
synx508I'm not even sure you need analogies to teach electrical basics to children, they're usually good at observation even if they appear not to be, just give them some decent kit to play with
LuminaxWkno no
cheater_abc_: so?
_abc_Austria is the birthplace of one, Adolf, nuke free, democratic, and the recognized center of inflation and of spying in Europe. You should not use tor, you live in one of the lands of the free :)
cheaterhow's that wrong
_abc_Which one of those things is?
cheaternever mind
_abc_Do you have Vorratsdatenspeicherung in .at?
LuminaxWksmaller pipe means more resistance
cheaterthis conversation is getting more weird by the minute
bongofuryget all yeah
ziongatesynx508: yes, the kit is for sure, preparing some wires and leds
cheateri'm gonna go take a nap
LuminaxWkthough I'm not sure how to relate the water speed inside the analogy
bongofuryguys, vienna's calling
ziongateLuminaxWk: yes that's the issue, smaller pipe should be more resistance, but the water current (if could be the speed) is higher
acetolineno no no
LuminaxWkwell... it's not the water speed that's current
acetolinethe current is not the speed
bongofuryanyone here like New Jersey?
LuminaxWkit's the amount flowing at any given second
LuminaxWkso given constant speed of water
LuminaxWkbigger diameter pipe means more water
LuminaxWkand smaller means less water
ziongateok, so i would maybe let water away and show some rock-based obstacles as resistance, so electrons take a different way
bongofurybut big pipes can have low flow
LuminaxWkif by analogously relating the height and speed of the water flow to a 'regulated voltage'
LuminaxWkthere you have it
bongofuryso you need to introduce pressure of the fluid
acetolinejust have them squeeze water through a syringe, with different-sized openings
synx508actually this has reminded me that I need to stealth-teach more electronic stuff to my nephew
acetolinethinner openings will be much harder to squeeze water through
acetolinemore resistance
LuminaxWk'the path of less resistance'
bongofuryvery large openings can have a trickle. That's phantom power.
synx508the path of less resistance is easy to teach, make a circuit, encourage the child to short out the battery supplying it
LuminaxWkACTION smaps bongofury
LuminaxWkno stirring the pots
bongofuryit's true
synx508make sure you use batteries that don't catch fire too quickly
acetolineelectricity _doesn't_ follow the path of least resistance
ziongatesynx508: yes, good
bongofurybig diameter, no flow = potential (voltage)
acetolineit goes through all paths, inversely proportional to resistance
ziongatei can bring limited PS
LuminaxWkacetoline: it flows more in the path of least resistance
bongofuryand capacitors are water tanks
LuminaxWkI = V/R ;D
bongofurywith pipes out the bottom
LuminaxWkmmmm tanks
acetolinebut telling them it flows through the path of least resistance distorts their understanding
LuminaxWknow.... how do you fit inductor in all that...
acetolinenope, water tanks don't work for capacitors
LuminaxWkah, I see what you mean
acetolinea capacitor looks more like this
LuminaxWksooooo lesse.... water pressure being analogous for... voltage ?
acetolinean inductor would be like a water wheel or something
synx508water doesn't work too well for - or + j
LuminaxWkah water wheel
LuminaxWkstoring kinetic energy
ziongateeh, seems not easy to find appropriate analogy, but a bit of distorsion maybe can be acceptable
bongofuryno, voltage isn't pressure
bongofuryit's pipe diameter
acetolineACTION slaps bongofury 
LuminaxWkziongate: if they don't understand the analogy, you drop to practical explanation
LuminaxWkACTION smaps bongofury 
LuminaxWkstop stirring the pot >_>
acetolineziongate: as previously mentioned, there are no perfect analogies
bongofurythis is the analogy
LuminaxWkyeah, analogies are just that, analogies
bongofurythat's how microphones work
ziongatelimpkin: yeah,i am asked for 1 hour lab session, not that serious, will mostly bring something for them to solder, but maybe just a introductive slide could be nice
bongofuryyou open a pipe with nothing in it
acetolineziongate: ignore bongofury, he's trolling
bongofuryno im quite not
LuminaxWkACTION sighs
bongofuryphantom power. +48V. microamps.
LuminaxWkmy brain's not quite turning today since I haven't had any sleep for 20+ hours
LuminaxWkand I can still all the stirring you're doing in the pot of analogy
ziongatebtw, thanks all
LuminaxWkphantom power is another DIFFERENT KETTLE OF FISH
LuminaxWkACTION sighs again
bongofuryDC is pushing, AC is pushing and pulling
acetolineI mean, the best analogy for electricity is... electricity!
LuminaxWkACTION pokes acetoline 
acetolineyou can build electrical circuits and see them work
LuminaxWkmight want to wiktionary 'analogy' ;P
Viper-7bongofury: DC can be pulling :P
ziongatelol yeah i can fill a desk of eqwuations as a first lesson :)
bongofuryyou're right
bongofuryunidirectional flow vs oscillating flow
ziongateso they hate it for the rest of tha life
ziongatewell apart joking, pratice is the best starting way probably
LuminaxWkziongate: never approach electric/electronic with equations first unless you have proper understanding of the basics
LuminaxWkit's horrendously confusing to newcomer
ziongateLuminaxWk: yes i think too. i could bring also some old boards to show how to desolder and store components
_abc_And yes Austria has full internet user data retention laws in force since 2012... @ cheater -- did not know this. Sorry.
acetolineziongate: btw this site: is pretty cool
acetolineshows electrical current through wires, and it shows voltage on a color scale
acetolineall evolving in real time
bongofuryokay voltage is pressure, when dealing with some kind of gravity-fed water analogy. specifically static head pressure
ziongateacetoline: ooooh thanks, nice ! stored in favourites
_abc_ACTION sort of hates falstad since it causes trouble in some older browsers.
LuminaxWkthis is js based right ?
LuminaxWkI got noscript on, forgot abot that lol
acetolinebongofury: you don't need gravity for pressure. But it does make it more intuitive
LuminaxWkgravity is accelaration going toward the earth's center
LuminaxWkand anything with mass accelarating creates force, which then acts upon an area thus creating pressure
LuminaxWkalso damn... I might need to disassemble this el Diablo's kit
LuminaxWkit's a good 12-bit adc, not sure if it's SAR or... what's the other popular one ?
LuminaxWkaaand sigma delta
LuminaxWkwonder what type this is
damke_wow, it took me this many hours to realize there are worksheets for that book :/
_abc_LuminaxWk: butter is the best proof for the fact that thin light substances which are messy are attracted more to the Earth than usual substances. Cue buttered bread falls butter down, >50% of cases :)
_abc_LuminaxWk: fast adc is almost always flash or modified (2-3 stage) flash
_abc_sigma delta is used almost only for audio
LuminaxWk_abc_: I'm willing to bet that's having to do with aerodynamic than gravitation
bongofuryacetoline - better terminology: pressure differential
_abc_LuminaxWk: it's folklore but a good joke
LuminaxWkACTION grins
LuminaxWkbeing a person who never butter his bread, I have no damn clue ;P
LuminaxWkI butter by dough, I don't butter my bread
LuminaxWkso _abc_, going by that folklore, a perfectly shaped croissant will spin on its croissantical axis continuously until it hits the ground? ;)
_abc_I don't know, I am not French. Some of the croissants sold here would probably dent the tarmac or become embedded in it, tip 1st.
bongofurybread kites... sounds american
LuminaxWkthat's what they're using to play american football, right? giant croissant
bongofurywrapped in pig skin
_abc_Looks like it from a distance on NTSC tv crt...
bongofurydeep fried to a golden brown
KodingKitty_I need to test my driver
acetolinea perfectly shaped croissant sounds delicious
LuminaxWkgive him a car ?
KodingKitty_I need to test those cases which are un-happy path executions. From device side very rarely they execute.
KodingKitty_So I need to create a USB device for that.
LuminaxWkah, the HID thingie ?
KodingKitty_Is that PIC18F4550 like device is enough for that?
KodingKitty_One HID interface and a two bulk channels.
KodingKitty_is that the normal way to test automate ?
KodingKitty_anyone done something like that before ?
LuminaxWkunfortunately I've not worked on the USB ends yet
LuminaxWkI've dabbled some with PIC's low pin usb devkit...
KodingKitty_If you have worked in PCI or whatever ends, what is the procedure.
LuminaxWkthey have quite a rocking USB stack
LuminaxWkcreating a test 'kit' for a driver or equipment depends on a lot of variables, what you're testing for, what are the faults conditions, how do you plan to catch faults conditions
LuminaxWkwhat are the failure potential of your failure test kit... etc etc
LuminaxWktesting, or creating a testing system usually borders on paranoia, you and your client (sometimes you're your own client) needs to find a point somewhere between total lockdown paranoia and total intrusion hackerspace
LuminaxWka point of compromise
LuminaxWkso again, ask yourself what are your test criterias
KodingKitty_Hi , I plan to catch fault conditions by , not receiving the correct response. Driver crash, kernel crash etc.
KodingKitty_The test kit should be able to support many un-expected un-happy responses.
KodingKitty_Which are harder to generate.
KodingKitty_is that fault injection is a the common technique used in this testing ?
KodingKitty_Isn't not normal to have a physical test kit for this
KodingKitty_Test criteria ,
KodingKitty_when the device is Dosing the driver, I need to check whether it has enough security implemented , it can't be crashed.
KodingKitty_When device is giving un-expected response to the driver, driver should handsomely handle it.
KodingKitty_No matter what USB device response, the driver can't be crashed.
KodingKitty_It should be bullet proof.
olspookishmagusso an "ion torch" is a fictional device?
LuminaxWkthat's a high bar...
LuminaxWkto answer your question about fault injection, yes it's quite a common technique
LuminaxWktest kits usually have their own sets of 'fault samples' for known and unknown faults
LuminaxWkbeing that it's a driver, the software side can do a try/catch routine and you can tweak all the other 'unknown errors' into the default catch blocks
LuminaxWkalthough, again, this is making an assumption of 'regular' unknown faults
LuminaxWkwhereas it could be electronically unknown random faults, in which case it's your circuit that needs to handle/filter/shape those into a 'known signal'
LuminaxWklike I mentioned earlier, once you go down the rabbit hole of 'what could possibly go wrong'...
LuminaxWkACTION does the middle finger salutes to Murphy
_abc_KodingKitty_: writing a test harness after the driver and the client exist is like rewriting it all from scratch. Bad idea. You were saddled with a lemon job. Intern?
_abc_Btw covering all the bad outcomes can make you write 5-6 times more code than originally in the system. Easily.
_abc_Plus you get to make it 'be #defined out' when releasing production code because embedded systems do not tolerate code bloat of that magnitude.
KodingKitty_I don't care I'm an intern or not. I love more work anyway.
KodingKitty_ACTION always an intern mode.
_abc_You are going to love this one, if it won't kill you you will be more resilient after it >;)
KodingKitty_ACTION loves to be an intern
_abc_The average system call via usb library on linux can have one good outcome and 4-5 error outcomes.
_abc_Complexity of related calls in an execution path gets from O(n) to O(n^3) or so
synx508don't handle the errors, that simplifies it
_abc_Oh and you get to write blurb and assign external logging messages to EACH of the bad cases.
synx508see also systemd
_abc_synx508: yes, "unknown exception @module crashed.c" works fine for embedded
_abc_systemd has NO good code paths >:)
_abc_ACTION is a #devuan fan
_abc_try { goodstuff(); } finally ( Exception e ) { barf(e); poke_tossup_all(); }
_abc_Except it's so much more fun doing that in C or embedded asm where Exceptions are the cough rule >;)
synx508just have the wdt working and catch exceptions with a while(1)
KodingKitty_synx508: what you mean by WDT and while(1), can you share that tip with us.
_abc_okay share it synx508
synx508you configure the watchdog timer to reset when it expires, while (1) (turn of interrupts before entering!) is a loop that loops forever - until the wdt expires and resets the system
Jck_trueWhile trawling through the chinese shopping sites has anyone found a configurable PSU module? One that lets you set the voltage and a current limiter through some protocol? UART, I2C, USB i don't care. Just want it cheap
synx508I should write a half-baked coding howto
_abc_synx508: you remember pic16c54 ? Someone wrote a timesharing asm system on that using the wdt as timer... there are no interrupts on that cpu...
_abc_synx508: 1990s
acetolineJck_true: sure, how expensive? :)
Viper-7still not that "cheap", but workable
Jck_trueViper-7: OMFG! Yes!
synx508_abc_, nice, and yes, I did a lot of asm for that chip.
_abc_What is DPS5005 Viper-7 ? Generic panel meter?
synx508there's actually an example of interrupt simulation in the programming manual for those early pics
Viper-750V 5A buck supply with adjustable CC/CV and color LCD display
KodingKitty_oky I'm still confused how that WDT could be used to generate fault injections ? Just by resetting the device ?
Viper-7basically a DC-DC bench psu
Jck_trueViper-7: Cheaper than just going on Farnell. And I was in fact looking at doing an ESP8266 integration myself
synx508using the timer and jump through NOPs to compensate for jitter between timer expiry and program counter
_abc_Viper-7: what's the wifi for?
_abc_synx508: yes I know. I still do cycle accurate asm for pics. Got so used to it it's easyer than other modern shit.
LuminaxWkfor draining your battery life
LuminaxWkwhat else
Viper-7_abc_: it doesnt have native wifi, but it does have a serial port, and opendps is a replacement firmware that gives that serial port proper control capabilities, and enables an option to attach an esp8266 to control / datalog from the supply remotely via wifi
_abc_Interesting beast. I wonder if it can be procured locally here.
Viper-7there are 30V5A, 30V12A, 50V5A and 50V15A versions
LuminaxWkman ... my Ali packaged touched down two days ago
LuminaxWkwhat's taking customs so long ><
LuminaxWkoh, wait... they're customs...
Viper-7LuminaxWk: heh :P
Viper-7yeah australia post has been slower than china post lately
LuminaxWka bunch of glorified tax-eater
LuminaxWkoh btw, my OSH-Park PCBs arrived, did I tell ?
Viper-77-10 days from china to hk to here, then 5-20 days from sydney to newcastle (about 1.5 hours drive)
LuminaxWkit's marvellous
LuminaxWknow I can have purple dc-dc converter modules on my board!
LuminaxWkif you have acquiantances, I found it faster to just 'rearrange' the shipping path locally then get them to air-freight your cargo for you
_abc_Because red ones were not cutting it?
_abc_LuminaxWk: where are you that you need such things?
LuminaxWk_abc_: I only have plain FR-4 coloured boards
_abc_What country.
Smidge204Red ones go faster. That's just science.
LuminaxWkgot lots of acquiantances going in and out of Shen Zen/ Dong Guan... might want to talk to them for a 'supply route'
LuminaxWkSmidge204: with prancing horse logo? ;D
LuminaxWkI...saw a deep blue ferrari a few days ago
LuminaxWkI was like WTF you're a ferrari, you're supposed to be RED
Smidge204For te price I'd hope you can get them in any color you want
_abc_Don't you have a healthy local market in modules in Malaysia already?
LuminaxWk_abc_: unfortunately, no
_abc_Smidge204: as long as it's black? (Henry Fort Model T quote)
LuminaxWkour 'local market' is a joke
_abc_LuminaxWk: interesting. Nobody even trying? Are customs rules brutal?
LuminaxWk_abc_: not quite
_abc_There's always a reason for this.
LuminaxWkthe thing is, it's not in high demand
LuminaxWknot many tinkers
_abc_Well SOME market exists.
Viper-7LuminaxWk: on that note, i've been thinking about trying dirty forwarding
Jck_trueViper-7: Just a quick question - that dps5005 module does step up as well right? I have a solid 12 V supply already.
_abc_Also Malaysia is an electronics manufacturing country, as is.
LuminaxWk_abc_: the audio'phile' market is more or less booming
Viper-7Jck_true: nope
LuminaxWk_abc_: eyup
_abc_LuminaxWk: So maybe there is a little bit of protectionism against locust country imports?
LuminaxWkalthough if you know some of the standards 'imposed' here, you'd wish you didn't have a factory here
LuminaxWk_abc_: it's quite the opposite
LuminaxWkour balding Water Spinach of a Prime Minister just opened a very rock-solid bridge to China
LuminaxWkand Huawei has been THE biggest name in telcos equipments
LuminaxWkbut that's just it, they're all 'finished products'
LuminaxWkwell, 'don't need is a bit too strong' but you get my point
Smidge204Trust me, I'm an Engineer
LuminaxWkACTION moves the quote mark a few spaces to the left
LuminaxWkanyway, chinese/taiwan brand is quite big here, but no modules
LuminaxWkwhat do you think the likelihood of there being a lot of tinkers when autoshop can sell "Fuel Saver Unit" with impunity ?
LuminaxWksome glorified caps-in-a-can...
Viper-7high, someones gotta be making dem fuel savers :P
LuminaxWkyeah, Chinese does
LuminaxWkidiots in this country buy
LuminaxWkmight as well roll those 50 ringgit bills and smoke 'em, my man!
LuminaxWkalthough with the introduction of polymer plastic bills lately, that has ceased to be 'feasible'
LuminaxWkcainiao site says :
LuminaxWkoh great... I don't have some of those sets in my kanji-list..
_abc_Your password is all '???'s here :) Please repost your password.
LuminaxWkanyway, it tells me it reached the 'exchange stations'
LuminaxWkaka customs
LuminaxWkwhoah I just fell asleep in front of my PC
MatCatThere 1 stripper disposed of
MatCatoops wrong chan
Verdido you have a qwert imprint on your forehead :p
LuminaxWkone moment I was testing the small LCD display... the next thing I know that thing morphed into a 40" monitor and is playing PS6
LuminaxWknope, this is a straight lumbar doze off
LuminaxWkI don't know what gave it away more, that the LCD transformed a-la Optimus Prime to a bigger LCD Screen
LuminaxWkor that PS6 in smexy silver that I saw... I wish I remember its shape, I could be clairvoyant!
kcrowcaw !
crtdon't be cuckin
kcrowbeware of teh cursed tuba
kcrowthe cursed tuba
kcrowit brings the ice waters of the north atlantic
acetolinecrt, are you drunk again
Smidge204This town isn't big enough for the tuba of us...
crttoo busy to drink welocme
acetolineI think I got my answer
crtoxygen bong.
acetolinesure, buddy.
crtwhere is ketis/
Smidge204"It's 6AM! Are you drunk already?!" "Nah, I'm just tired 'cause I've been up all night drinking..."
crt circuits?
MeadA while back an at&t tech made a mess of the telephone wiring in my house's attic when we converted from POTS to VOIP, anyone know of a good piece of literature for the proper way to building/repairing a residential telephone system?
acetolinehow much experience in electrical/electronics do you have
MeadA moderate amount, I am more of a network guy.
acetolinewhat is the problem with the wiring?
ArmandYou called
Smidge204AFAIK there's only two wires and every phone in the house us wired in parallel. It ain't rocket surgery.
Smidge204For cleanliness I suppose all wires should start from a central splice box rather than having splices and branches in multiple locations, but it doesn't seem to matter much in practice
Meadwell, it use to all terminate nicely into some small do-hicky that I don't know the name of, but the guy mucked around and all the two line phone wires now have line 1 twisted together can covered with plastic caps, and line 2 isn't even connected.
Meaderr twisted together and covered up with plastic caps
Smidge204Line 2 doesn't matter unless you have two lines
Smidge204And you can untwist Line 1.
Smidge204ACTION shrugs
Smidge204More importantly, since you went to VoIP, do you even have POTS service anymore? What would you connect them to?
Meadlike 8 pairs of wires twisted together to distribute the power/signal
MeadThis carries the voip to all the wall sockets of the house
Smidge204Yeah, and? Like I said, all the phones are wired in parallel
Smidge204So you should have two wires coming out of the service box (AT&T equipment) and connecting to wires leading to every phone jack you plan to use
Meadthe uverse gateway can run two lines,
Smidge204Do you actually have two lines?
Meadbut the real issue that irritates me is that when I first tested out the service after it was installed my vintage rottery phone worked, then after going through and putting a phone into every room the pulse dialing quit working.
MeadSmidge204: I will soon
acetolineso your major problem is that your stupid hipster phone doesn't work?
MatCatWhy does my office smell like a damned italian resturant
MeadI like vintage electronics, don't call me a hipster because
acetolineI used to think the audiophiles and the plumber's flux crowd were amusing, but this one takes the cake
MatCatget high on the tube distoration magic
MatCatACTION gives acetoline a dose of harmonic distoration
MatCatso soothinng and smooooooth :P
acetolineACTION has an aur-gasm
Meadacetoline: do you or do you not know where I could find the information I am asking about?
acetolineMead, let me suggest that there are more pressing concerns in the world than your 'vintage' phone
acetolinewar, poverty, climate change, the US president
acetolineand all you are worried about is that your rotary phone doesn't work
acetolineGod, please kill me
MatCatACTION shoots acetoline
acetolinekill us all, the human race doesn't deserve to live
acetolineplease, just send us all to hell
MatCatACTION is actually a real life gun guy :P
acetolineMatCat: thank you
acetolinesweet relief
Meadacetoline: which end of the goat do you eat first?
HrdwrBoBI am a real life fun guy
MatCatThese are just my pistols, I have just as many rifles
HrdwrBoBMatCat: why is the hammer cocked on that pistol
MatCatHrdwrBoB: Cause it is a defense gun and I keep it loaded
MatCatthat is a 1911, it is generally my car gun
MeadACTION will ask again later when adults are around
kcrowbeware of the cursed tuba !!!!
MatCatsafety is engaged too though on it
kcrowteh icy waters of the north atlantic yearn to cool some circuits
MatCatthe grey and black one is my primary carry
MatCatIt is on my body 24/7
MatCatthe black and silver one is my backup, I carry it at work, when I am off work it generally sits in the office or car
Mangy_Dogactually afternoon i overslept :(
weyland|yutaniMangy_Dog, well at least you can open a case of beer because.....its already afternoon :)
Mangy_Dogi dont really drink
Armandweyland|yutani: It's always beer o' clock somewhere in the world.
Mangy_Dogalso... american beer is... well its pretty weak, so i guess its like drinking a lemonade :p UK beer/EU beer is more... punchy :p
weyland|yutaniMangy_Dog, just start playing this music and start drinking
ArmandBud is the closest the Yanks do to a decent beer.
listeit's always beer o' clock *everywhere* in the world!
ArmandThey really just don't make any really good booze.
weyland|yutaniMangy_Dog, well i tried brooklyn lager from carlsberg brewery it wasnt so bad
listenah, americans have great breweries too, like Founders
Mangy_Dogomfg, i almost didnt recognise him... a young pre face fuck up micky rourk
weyland|yutaniits from the movie barfly
Mangy_Dogbut yes, drinking alone... proof it really is time to get a new liver
Flea86crt: An oldie.. but a goodie :)
crteat it or beat it
Flea86crt: inb4 Weird Al Yankovic
Flea86nah he a gud guy
Flea86*ye nah
ned0that was an interesting click
ned0for 8am
crtthis one is even beter
Mad7ScientistDoes anyone know where to get belts for VCRs and tape players at reasonable prices? I need supplier that lists sizes.
kludgeAs far as I know, the only choice left in the US is Russell Industries/ PRB Line.
bart416Probably on aliexpress you can find them
Mad7ScientistI'm buying tape deck repair belts from They have a minimum order of $25 or else they add a fee and It's $9 for shipping using the USPS $3 first class package rate. Does anyone need anything from this electronics supplier like a single belt or something? I'm short of the minimum order. I can get whatever small thing it is to you. :)
kludgeYou may have to get the paper catalogue as well.
Rob235for about 8-12 amps is there any benefit to going with one of these types of casings: over something like this:
Mad7ScientistI'll buy from them if I can't find another place
kludgeMad7Scientist: If you're ordering, I'll pay you for an FRW 10.1 and an SCX 7.0.
FuchikomaRob235: The open case is obviously better ventilated, but also more exposed. Which is more important is up to you
Rob235well is there any chance of the closed one overheating?
Mad7Scientistkludge, there are no products matching FRW 10.1
kludgeRob235: not if it's well-designed and used within spec.
Mad7ScientistFuchikoma, thanks but those all seem to have part numbers but no sizes
Rob235ok, I'll get a 10-12 amp one then as its going to be using 8 amp max
FuchikomaThey give measuring instructions
Rob235Id rather the closed design
kludgeoops, that's no good.
kludgeMad7Scientist: But yeah, those are standard PRB numbers. FRW is a flat belt, 10.1 is 10 inches inside circumference, .120 width, thickness of .023.
Mad7Scientistkludge, what company is that PDF from?
kludgeSCX 7.0 is a square cut belt, 7.0 inside diameter.
kludgeMad7Scientist: those are PRB Line part numbers, likely that PDF originally came from PRB/Russell Industries.
Mad7ScientistSo I can't order based on taht PDF
FuchikomaYou might also try SDP/SI as a supplier
kludgeMad7Scientist: You can if you're ordering from any PRB dealer. Otherwise you'll have to find equivalent sizes.
Mad7Scientistok isn't outrageous but the shipping is
Mad7ScientistFuchikoma, smcelectroncs is even more expensive
FuchikomaACTION shrugs
kludgeI don't know ceitron. For years we had a local electronics shop that carried PRB stuff, now I have to order it online.
FuchikomaIf they have what you need but can't find anywhere else then it's not expensive
kludgeI hate fixing consumer electronics.
bart416Heheh, true that!
bart416What works for small rubber parts is freezing with liqduid nitrogen
bart416And then quickly milling it
bart416But for belts that's not feasible :(
kludgebart416: I have done that for pinch rollers.... it works okay for natural rubber where the surface becomes hard from oxidation but the material down below is still good. It doesn't work for urethanes.
Mad7Scientistkludge, they have 12" X .031" X 10.2"
bart416kludge, never had to do it on urethane rubber.
Mad7ScientistThat's the closest that I see.
kludgeBut pinch rollers you can just get rebuilt.
bart416Did have to try it on this sort of siliconeish fluorinated stuff, worked well for that.
kludgeMad7Scientist: don't bother then. I'll put a PRB order in when enough stuff builds up here.
Mad7ScientistIt would work it's just a little thicker
Mad7ScientistWhat's the minimum order for PRB?
kludgeMad7Scientist: Dunno. And they have a lot of dealers so you don't have to order direct. But sooner or later I'll need something crazy and then it'll all go in.
bart416kludge, and the fun bit is that custom parts in China got really really really cheap :p
bart416And if it's silicone rubber you can go all-out :D
kludgebart416: If you know a place that can do threaded brass tubes for cheap (out of real brass), let me know!
Mad7Scientistkludge, do you know the exact size or did you measure it?
kludgebart416: My problem is everyone wants a minimum of 10,000, and my order of 100 items is ignored.
bart416kludge, weird
bart416Did you try mould manufacturers?
Mad7ScientistIs this on aliexpress?
bart416Those are usually willing to do weird stuff
bart416Sadly no
kludgeMad7Scientist: I got out the PRB book and looked up the model machine and it said I needed those two belts.
Mad7Scientistoh ok
kludgebart416: I haven't. For pinch rollers, I'd prefer if the rubber was rolled on rather than molded, though.
Mad7Scientistkludge, prices seem to be over $10 per belt for PRB dealers
Mad7Scientistinstead of $3
kludgeMad7Scientist: Yeah, not too bad. Figure dealer takes half.
bart416kludge, the mould manufacturers are fairly reasonable for pricing for custom parts, but don't know if they'll do rubber finishes.
bart416I've had custom tooling done a few times for projects at work, and a mould with fairly strict tolerances and stuff like sub 600 micron vacuum holes in hard to reach places, etc. ran like 150 euro.
kludgebart416: We're down to I think one company left in the US doing recapping for tape machine pinch rollers... used to be millions of companies that rebuilt typewriter platens and could do it but those are all gone.
kludgeBut yeah, there are lots of people doing weird shaped gaskets out there, so you'd think precision molding wouldn't be a big deal.
bart416Did you actually ask a gasket manufacturer?
kludgebart416: I haven't, I didn't even think about that.
bart416I also saw some idiots try to reline it with shrink tubing.
kludgebart416: the problem is that it needs to be very, very very round. Which probably could be dealt with by machining after molding.
bart416Actually check J.J. Short Associates
bart416They keep popping up on googling for folks that still do rubber on typewriter rollers
kludgeACTION nodsd.
kludgeOkay, I have to go see if people fixed things they were supposed to fix. Back later.
paulrsgot a fakko 951 from china
paulrsjust arrived 7 days after ordering
FuchikomaI know my quality brand names when I see 'em!.. Sorny, Magnetbox, Panaphonics...
paulrscost 56 inc free dhl postage from china.
Mad7Scientistoh where is kludge!!! I have 0.047" X 7.0" :(
Mad7ScientistDoes kludge have OCD
Mad7ScientistI have a belt for much cheaper that's very close to the proper size
Mad7Scientistbut he doesn't want it
bitdNeai, whatsup.
bitdWhy are you sending me CTCPs?
Mad7ScientistOnly 2,00GHz
bitdMad7Scientist, this is relevant how?
bitdAlso, says the guy running a 32 bit OS :P
Mad7Scientistyeah I know
ned0oh no
ned0i forgot my nick and just ctcp some random ned
hjfso it seems my commodore 64 has a bad RAM IC
hjfand i found the replacement at a quite unexpected place
hjf...the local electronics store
hjfwhich usually only stocks 7805 and 555
zap0wtf! is it a shop from the 80's?
zap0is it an orignal tandy/radio-shack?
hjfno it's more from the 50s i think . it's in Argentina
hjfi mean the IC is a standard part. TMS4164
zap0do they still sell C64s?
hjfno lol
hjfthey are diversifying nowadays
hjfselling power tools and stuff
zap0power tools and RAM chips. interesting store!
hjfbut their core business is still replacement parts and electrical stuff (like wire, outlets and stuff like that)
kcrowmaking some delicious grits to go with my plllz
bobo1on1interesting power supply
bobo1on1ACTION wonders where the fuse is
gazelleWhat should one consider when deciding between 0.8 mm and 1.6 mm PCB?
SpeedEvilgazelle: 1.6mm is standard and is likely cheaper
EuroTrashbobo1on1: "super poewr" hmmm
EuroTrashIt seems nice but a tad bit expensive if you go over the components.
Emilgazelle: mounting
Emilgazelle: otherwise 0.8 is much more kawaii
Emiland from OSHPark it's also 2Oz
bobo1on1EuroTrash: yes but can you build the same thing for less?
Emil1.6mm is sturdier
Emilbut 0.8mm is so much nicer imho
Viper-7woo, my wifi solar data-logger is complete - flashed and plugged into the inverter - now just to wait for sunrise so the inverter actually turns on to say something :P
EuroTrashIn quantities :D
Emilgazelle: but other than mounting, nothing else, really
EuroTrashI mean, in parts, it could be done for maybe half that, but gotta make the PCB, etc.
bobo1on1don't forget the housing
gazelleEmil: is SMT on 1.6 mm easier (and thus cheaper) or the other way round?
EmilAnd by mounting I mean through hole parts
EuroTrashThose aren't that expensive on Ali
Emilgazelle: for surface mount there is no difference
bobo1on1true but it does add up
Emilgazelle: and seeed does 0.8mm the same price as 1.6mm
bobo1on1I do wonder what's up with the complex design instead of using an lm317 or lm338
EuroTrashAnd if I wanted something like that, I'd want brand-name caps as well.
EuroTrashWell it's gotta look like something!
EmilMy PCBs from OSHPark turned out beaaaautiul
mwbrownFound something interesting in a datasheet and was wondering if anyone here has an insight why this might be
Mad7ScientistDoes anyone need belts from They have a rather high minimum order
EuroTrash"Supper DC" hmm
hjfEmil: b-e-a...utiful?
EuroTrashNeed a different one for breakfast?
mwbrownthe Si7021 temp/humidity sensor says the GND pin needs to be soldered to a trace and NOT directly to a ground plane. Any idea why that is?
bobo1on1the caps are a brand name, it's just a brand that nobody has every heard of
Mad7ScientistThey have a large assortment of VCR belts
EuroTrashHah, score
Emilhjf: hm?
hjfEmil: Ace Ventura?
Emilmwbrown: as long as you have thermal reliefs you are fine
Mad7ScientistViper-7, can your invention handle the harsh conditions of Mars?
gazelleEmil: what about the robustness for plugging/unplugging a microUSB connector mounted on the PCB? I'm seeing opposing arguments: 0.8 mm being more flexible seems to be an advantage
hjfwell not ace ventura
hjfbut still jim carrey
mwbrownEmil: is it just as a manufacturability thing then? I was wondering if there was something electrically related
Emilmwbrown: welll, I mean, rf black magic is always a thing
Emilbut I mean
EmilFor that sensor
falseascensionGot a small black cylinder off a PCB, thought it was a diode but no markings on it at all, any idea what it is?
falseascensionIt's creating a dead short
EuroTrashSnap a pic
mwbrownI've seen chokes that come in these weird cylinder packages
falseascensionPhones broken, can't get a picture
Viper-7Mad7Scientist: im not sure it'll handle the harsh conditions of my back porch, but we'll see
falseascensionLooks like a 1n4007, except it's just completely gray
EuroTrashNo marking on the board either?
falseascensionjust a square silkscreen
mwbrownI built a circuit with axial chokes that looked something like that iirc
EuroTrashAny pics of the pcb/device on google?
mwbrownor ferrite beads. Big one could be mistaken for a diode
falseascensionDoubt it, i'll check
falseascensionPCB on the left, small diode-looking thing next to the switch
falseascensionUnder those two red wires
mwbrownMy vote is ferrite bead. Got an LCR meter to check?
falseascensionSadly not
mwbrownIt makes sense there would be one near the power input on an amp
falseascensionActually, it looks like it's going to the headphone out
falseascensionThanks, i'm trying to figure out why the abttery isn't making connection when power is unplugged, doesn't look like this is the problem
falseascensionThe heck
falseascensionThe barrel jack is breaking the connection to battery when unplugged, rather than creating it
marvin3would drilling a hole and putting a nail inside a dowel should increase its shear strength?
marvin3gluing the nail inside it
Chillumhuh, for the second time in a week every clock in my house reset and all my computers are off as though the power went out
Chillumbut my neighbours did not have an outage and the power company lists no outages for my region
Chillumirritating as I have a lot of computer
ChillumACTION needs a UPS
bobo1on1marvin3: you can get steel dowels
_abc_ good one
marvin3bobo1on1 trying to use what I have. I'm replacing steel pin with a wooden dowel. not sure if wood will hold by itself
bobo1on1well they're using steel for a reason
marvin3can always drill the dowel out and replace it with a steel one if it fail
archivistwhy are you replacing steel dowels have they failed
archivistif so the bodge will fail faster
marvin3thin metal holder around the dowel has craked. steel dowel is fine, but I have no easy way to attach it back
marvin3and it is too short to glue it in
archivistseems the wrong repair
marvin3anyway, wooden dowel is already glued in place of it, now I just have to decide whether to leave it as it is or to reinforce it (or maybe it would weaken it?) with a nail
archivistbolt with washers to clamp the plate
archivistseems obvious to me more not less strength needed
marvin3i think dowel glued 1 inch deep into the wood should be stroned than that thin piece of metal that was holding the metal pin. the question is only if wooden dowel itself will break
_abc_<off topic but interesting> Interesting how all the bobbing yellow rubber duckies congregate around 30degN and 30degS ...
_abc_One could draw some conclusions from that. Perhaps even look for MH370 debris there?
restorerpossible, but I don't see how that would be much help
bart416Got to love how they list garden variety pumps as high pressure on aliexpress
bart416I'm looking for something in the 25 MPa range, lol
restorerliteral garden variety? :D
bart416The type of pump you'd use to water your plants from a well :|
bart416They call that high pressure, lawl
bart416I'm thinking DIY waterjet cutter range
restorerI can't imagine they mean "pressure" in their distinct sense of "voltage" either
bart416Yeah, they list 0.25 MPa pumps as high pressure, lawl
bart416But yeah, there's a guy who converted a pressure washer into a waterjet
bart416And if they can sell it with the pump already in a pressure washer for 100 bucks you must be able to get the pump alone cheaper from China :P
restorerI could've bought an ultrasonic atomizer bit for $5-$6, but without a 3D printer, I had to buy a whole $25 nebulizer device to fit my needs :-\
restorerbut still compared to a comparable US medically-approved portable nebulizer at $150+...
restorerI really did want something very minimal though